Curse

Jeydra · Apr 21, 2012, 03:16 AM // 03:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by superraptors

5. lucky? being lucky and random is the same thing.

ok lets say we nerf heroes to oblivion, are you still going to enjoy steam rolling ai and feel satisfied?(im guessing yes) if so you should stick to pve because that is basically the same thing.

also im 100% sure you started pvping in 2009 and onwards where the game has already deteriorated.

Then you are 100% wrong.

If I respond to you more I'll be getting trolled (in fact I already am getting trolled - this is like the third time in this thread you've claimed you know more about me + my friends than I do). Whatever.

Missing HB · Apr 21, 2012, 07:49 AM // 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

...

Ok, but the OP meant having full parties of heroes, not only having 2-3.
You can already have 2-4 henchs in parties today, replacing them by heroes won't do anything towards inactivity..

Then, if i guess dealing with a party of 7 henchs won't be luch a matter vs a team of 8 humans.. If the guy is good with controlling henchs, he has a chance. If the guy isn't, he will get facerolled.

And i think we should seriously stop talking about the past... It used to be at a different time, with more activity, diferent metagame, etc...
RA is terrible for years and is still played today. Same for FA, although it's completly flawed. Yet, those formats that are still balanced are mostly inactive( i'm right now alone in HA id1 although it's quest day...)

bhavv · Apr 23, 2012, 07:22 PM // 19:22

I stopped playing HA when they removed hero teams as it was no longer fun for me. I used to highly enjoy just being able to add 3 heroes and two henchies and clicking enter battle and winning a few rounds. I managed to win the final level too with 1 other player and 4 heroes, which was in fact the single only time I've ever won HoH and I'm rank 7.

I hate waiting to find a group. I hate the elitism from other players. I don't mind losing as long as I can simply make up any randomway and just go go go and enjoy playing the damn game. That's why I only RA now because there's no waiting for a group. You just go in, click enter battle and you're right into the fun. Even if I lose I've still enjoyed playing because I've gotten to play a format that I enjoy. I thoroughly despised HB because the flag capture stuff was crap. I just want fast and easy all hero teams PVP and one that lets me progress my hero title.

Lycan Nibbler · Apr 23, 2012, 11:13 PM // 23:13

replace pvp with hero battles!

tealspikes · Apr 24, 2012, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by superraptors

no one can rupt 1/4 skills unless:
1. botting
2. random
3. pre-emptive
4. you can see into the future

Heroes nor bots can interrupt 1/4 skills. 'Rupts take 1/4 seconds to cast, so even if it is activated immediately after the opponent's 1/4 cast skill, it will miss. What most people experience is lucky collateral 'rupts from CoF/Tease. This is easily observed, even with Panic in pve many monsters get their 1/4 casts interrupted.

superraptors · Apr 24, 2012, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by tealspikes

Heroes nor bots can interrupt 1/4 skills. 'Rupts take 1/4 seconds to cast, so even if it is activated immediately after the opponent's 1/4 cast skill, it will miss. What most people experience is lucky collateral 'rupts from CoF/Tease. This is easily observed, even with Panic in pve many monsters get their 1/4 casts interrupted.

yes they can.

Auron of Neon · Apr 24, 2012, 07:49 AM // 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by tealspikes

Heroes nor bots can interrupt 1/4 skills. 'Rupts take 1/4 seconds to cast, so even if it is activated immediately after the opponent's 1/4 cast skill, it will miss. What most people experience is lucky collateral 'rupts from CoF/Tease. This is easily observed, even with Panic in pve many monsters get their 1/4 casts interrupted.

It's possible for heroes and bots to hit them. They do it all the time. The ghostly hero NPC in halls dshots quarter second casts fairly regularly, and that even has travel time.

It doesn't make sense, but not making sense doesn't stop it from happening.

Surgo · Apr 24, 2012, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auron of Neon

It's possible for heroes and bots to hit them. They do it all the time. The ghostly hero NPC in halls dshots quarter second casts fairly regularly, and that even has travel time.

It doesn't make sense, but not making sense doesn't stop it from happening.

Hold on -- at what range are they successfully dshotting this? Because in FoW I can run through the spider cave and not get Shadow Form (1 second cast time, minus Essence) interrupted by Savage Shot (same cast time as dshot) merely by standing at longbow range. Same deal with the Impalers on Battlefield, and they actually have dshot. Does the ghostly hero have a superior AI package or something?

Missing HB · Apr 24, 2012, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auron of Neon

It's possible for heroes and bots to hit them. They do it all the time. The ghostly hero NPC in halls dshots quarter second casts fairly regularly, and that even has travel time.

If that was really true, the ghostly wouldn't miss any rupt. Besides, i've played rspike with heroes in HB sometimes and i can tell you i rarely saw my opponent rupted...

Let's assume we had teams of mesmers with 7 rupts . Basically, you'd say the wouldn't let the opponent use any skill. Pretty strange those teams didn't rule the ladder in HB isn't it ? Pretty strange that there wasn't any guild using it in GvG isn't it ?

So, we come to say that npc's are rupting some skills and not others. If they were failing half interupts, everyone would say " waaa npcs suck, can they get better?? ", which would lead to everyone complaining again...

side note : heroes were removed from PvP about 3 years ago, how do you know that heroes are " doing it all the time " ???? I thought talking about the past was not making sense..

Reverend Dr · Apr 24, 2012, 08:06 PM // 20:06

The ghostly misses rupts because of flight time. I've seen the ghost d-shot infuse on several occasions. He is still a beast. If you were running rspike in HB then you were microing your heroes and they won't use other skills until after they are being microed. This also brings up another reason to avoid large numbers of heroes, back during the 3 hero day it wasn't uncommon for someone to bring three heroes with spike skills and micro a perfect spike every time, with more heroes it could only become more obnoxious.

Heroes very rarely miss spell based interrupts and only then because the interrupt is used immediately after another spell such that the computer thinks it has enough time but with aftercast it does not.

We are talking about the way heroes acted in PvP, while it has been a long time since heroes have been in PvP, to think that these things have just fixed themselves is absurd.

Jeydra · Apr 24, 2012, 11:27 PM // 23:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auron of Neon

It's possible for heroes and bots to hit them. They do it all the time. The ghostly hero NPC in halls dshots quarter second casts fairly regularly, and that even has travel time.

It doesn't make sense, but not making sense doesn't stop it from happening.

If I could count on my heroes to interrupt 1/4s spells, I'd be on easy street. Unfortunately, I have never seen my heroes interrupt Gelatinous Absorption.

superraptors · Apr 25, 2012, 12:00 AM // 00:00

im pretty sure any one who played backline back then had their infuse or rof dshotted multiple times.

tealspikes · Apr 25, 2012, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Yup that happens when you queue up spells as backline love to do. Ghostly misses the Woh due to flight time or other factors as Reverend mentioned and hits the patient came right after. I seen it happen soo so much.

Auron of Neon · Apr 25, 2012, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by tealspikes

Yup that happens when you queue up spells as backline love to do. Ghostly misses the Woh due to flight time or other factors as Reverend mentioned and hits the patient came right after. I seen it happen soo so much.

Na, he reflex interrupts spells. I played mesmer, I rarely queued spells and cancelcasted often - but I've had pdrains dshotted out of the blue (like no spells cast in the previous 5-10 seconds). He's not trying to hit another spell, he's literally going for pdrain and hitting it.

And as other people have mentioned, he hits infuses and stuff too. It's not a fluke, his AI is just really that good; too good, honestly. And heroes were the same with interrupts. That's why people ran heroes with 3-4 interrupts and enchant removal or smites - and why PvP against heroes was such a shitfestival. People didn't try to run balanced builds on them, they ran gimmicks that exploited the ridiculous AI. Trying to juke out a human playing ranger by cancelcasting and forcing them to waste dshot was fun, quality gameplay; getting half my skills interrupted (no matter what I did) was not.

superraptors · Apr 25, 2012, 12:04 PM // 12:04

pretty much what auron said and they basically know your client-side commands in an instant.

also

heroes know exactly what you are doing(pretty much what some bots did showing who was being targeted), if you played warrior during tease heroes were rampant every time you targeted a new person(even without calling it) within 1 second a weapon spell would be applied on to him/her.

Jeydra · Apr 25, 2012, 12:43 PM // 12:43

I got a question for you Auron. PDrain casts in 1/4s, not including Fast Casting. DShot casts in 1/2s, not including flight time. How can the Ghostly Hero possibly reflex PDrain?

Missing HB · Apr 25, 2012, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Let's just bring back heroes in PvP for a week and see the results on activity i guess... We'll be able to see also if heroes are so OP as they're supposedly are...

I'm sorry, but with all due respect, i'm 99.9% sure i used heroes in PvP probably at least 5 times longer than anyone here, and i won't trust someone who just makes arguments based on the result of a few hours against heroes...

And seriously, stop using the " fun " argument... It does happen when it gets repetitive and boring, which is the case for anything in the game today... You can also add the fairness problem( syncers/cheaters/1v1 halls/ dc's at 0.01 in mat/etc...)

Auron of Neon · Apr 25, 2012, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

I got a question for you Auron. PDrain casts in 1/4s, not including Fast Casting. DShot casts in 1/2s, not including flight time. How can the Ghostly Hero possibly reflex PDrain?

I point you to my earlier comment - not making sense doesn't stop it from happening. Do tombs. Play caster classes. You *will* get dshotted by the ghostly hero on quarter second casts from time to time - reflex interrupt, out-of-the-blue quarter second casts will be nailed, despite cast time and travel time. Trying to theorycraft here is pointless. I *played the game* and this happened. Raptors *played the game* and it happened. Rev *played the game* and it happened. Trying to sit here and tell me that it's impossible because of skill descriptions is pointless, because it happened to all of us. Play the game and find out.

Jeydra · Apr 26, 2012, 10:43 AM // 10:43

The mathematics say it is impossible. You can't argue with mathematics, unless you are implying that either 1) the Ghostly Hero has the ability to read your mind and act 1/4s before you do, or 2) skills don't work the way they should on AI.

I've had 1/4s casts interrupted by RA Rangers. It happens. I remember Trojan boasting once that his team spiked out rawr because he DShot Awowa's Infuse. Doesn't make him a bot or some magical mind reader.

I argue that you are selectively remembering the times when you get DShot on 1/4s casts and neglecting the times when the Ghostly DShots nothing.

DRGN · Apr 26, 2012, 02:26 PM // 14:26

I was under the impress Ghostly knew and acted on your inputs before your character actually started using the skill or something dumb like that. The worst I've had was him dchopping an axe Bull's(Which I thought was kind of bullshit but I chalked it up to ghostly hax) and dshotting song like an asshole through a pillar I thought was obstructed. I've never had one of my 1/4s casts interrupted though since I lagged too much to play mesmer in HA